00:00:03:07 - 00:00:16:23
Chris
Hello and welcome to the ending Body Burn Out Show. We are your host, Chris and Filly co-founders of a multi-award-winning winning functional medicine practice, serving busy people with energy, mood and gut issues.
00:00:17:00 - 00:00:24:21
Filly
While busyness, addictive doing, people pleasing and perfectionism might be the norm, it's not normal and it's a major contributor to health issues.
00:00:25:00 - 00:00:38:05
Chris
Our goal with this show is to give you a holistic root, root cause approach to healing your body so that you don't have to continue doctor or diet hopping or popping any gazillion supplements hoping something might stick.
00:00:38:05 - 00:00:46:07
Filly
Sorry, get ready to heal your body, get your spark back deeply, connect with yourself and step into the life of your dreams.
00:00:46:10 - 00:00:55:10
Chris
Let's dive in.
00:00:55:12 - 00:01:34:05
Filly
Hello. One, two fools. Welcome to the body. Today you are in for a treat today. Before we get started, announcement time to night to night is our Brisbane book party. So if you're in Brisbane or Gold Coast Sunshine Curry somewhere in between and you are free tonight, come along at two scrumptious reads in this suburb, Ready Hugh, which is very close to Brisbane City and Chris and I are going to be having a book party as part of our book tour for the launch of our book Ending Body Burn Out.
00:01:34:07 - 00:02:04:08
Filly
I'm going to be in conversation with the amazing Melanie Oldfield. She was actually on our podcast last year. She has a business which is all about stacked Whole Foods nutrition. Food is medicine. She is a brilliant woman and she's going to bring some some energy and some wisdom, too, to the event. We'll also have some brain retraining, nervous system practices happening.
00:02:04:08 - 00:02:32:00
Filly
We're going to have laughs and fun and there's going to be food and refreshments and it's going to be so fun. So if you want to come along, get inspired about ending your body, burn out the steps to take to do that, to find your spark, and also know that you will leave the not feeling energised. Then we have some spaces left so you can go to the link below the show notes and RSVP for that.
00:02:32:02 - 00:02:58:17
Filly
And the other thing too is next month we have quite a few five actually free events or low cost events that we're putting on. The one that I want to mention today is the three day live training, which is all about stress burn out and why your protocol isn't working. That is completely free. It's I think it starts on the 22nd.
00:02:58:19 - 00:03:00:06
Lisa
Ish.
00:03:00:08 - 00:03:24:02
Filly
Of May and we would love you to attend. And if you want to learn more about that again, head to the show notes and I'll put the link there for you to register for that. Okay. So today I am talking to the gorgeous life coach, a laser carafe who is a woman who wears many hats. She is an inspiration.
00:03:24:02 - 00:03:31:19
Filly
When I first came across laser on socials, I was so drawn into her region as she is raw and honest and.
00:03:31:19 - 00:03:32:19
Lisa
Messy.
00:03:32:21 - 00:04:05:21
Filly
And wholeheartedly leaning into life in all its challenges. She's a successful businesswoman, has created amazing online business and courses that are going gangbusters and have for the past decade. She was married to a man, beautiful man, Nick, who was an alcoholic in and out of rehab while also juggling a business and mothering. And as we chat, you'll discover that in 2019, Nick passed away.
00:04:05:23 - 00:04:42:22
Filly
And so not only was she navigating the juggle of life, but that she was left single mum being and protecting her children and trying to work through her own grief as well. So you are in for a treat, she says very honestly, very vulnerably, and she is a source of inspiration. I actually went out on a girl's weekend with my mum and sisters to manly it back in March and we were sitting at the table.
00:04:42:22 - 00:05:09:04
Filly
We went out for dinner and my sister grabbed some random question. She's like questions to ask at a dinner table. One of the questions was Who is someone that you really look up to or who you find really inspirational and straight up? I said, Lisa, she is really cool. She's also, if you read my book, Anything Body Burn Out said, Remember we're doing a book launch party tonight in Brisbane.
00:05:09:06 - 00:05:41:09
Filly
She actually wrote the forward for my book and she wrote the most perfect words to the start of my book. I actually when I got the email back from her and read her foreword, I was I was literally in tears. It was perfect. It was exactly what I wanted the start of the book to, to capture and sorry that this is the lady behind the words.
00:05:41:11 - 00:06:11:16
Filly
Okay, so official buyer Lisa Carafe has built an online business helping women get unstuck and upgrade their lives in simple yet powerful ways. She is a solo mum of three and she's all about avoiding the perfectionism and overwhelm that can so easily keep us trapped. She is a powerful storyteller and she shares her journey through grief in a captivating, captivating and inspire way.
00:06:11:17 - 00:06:31:23
Filly
Okay, so without further ado, let's dive in to my conversation with Lisa. Lisa, I'm so, so excited to have you on our podcast. We would just say before we hit record, this is actually the first time we've spoken in Real Zoom life.
00:06:32:01 - 00:06:35:16
Lisa
Which is ridiculous because I'm like, We're friends. We know each other. Yeah, yeah.
00:06:35:16 - 00:06:58:12
Filly
It's like in-stadium voicemails. Yeah. Sorry. I'm. I'm so excited. I know our listeners are going to get so much out of this conversation and so much that you talk about and that you do and the way that you work with other women so aligns wi with what we do to burn out busyness, overwhelm all the things.
00:06:58:14 - 00:06:58:16
Lisa
That.
00:06:58:19 - 00:07:00:07
Filly
Live.
00:07:00:09 - 00:07:19:01
Lisa
Yep. Yeah, yeah. And I think that's why I love what you do. I remember seeing you first sort of appear on the same thinking, thank God someone's talking about it in this way because I hadn't really seen it before. So I absolutely love what you do, which, you know.
00:07:19:03 - 00:07:33:08
Filly
Thank you. Thank you. Okay. We're going to just dive straight into the personal stuff, into your own body burn out story. When was it? What was happening? Give us all the juice.
00:07:33:10 - 00:07:58:22
Lisa
Well, it's funny because I actually think that there's been a few probably like most people, especially like. Yeah, right. I mean, I remember getting pneumonia in my twenties and being like, What's this thing that's happening to my body? Ignoring it completely, moving straight along, You know, it's just it's crazy. Anyway, but the one, the one moment that I really had that actually I stopped and I paid attention to, I was like, okay, this is no joke.
00:07:58:22 - 00:08:27:14
Lisa
My body's going back up. Lisa was it was 2017, so and life was kind of blowing up, so I'm not too sure people won't know my story, but my, my husband at the time had been he'd been off work for a little while. Things were unravelling for him and his dependence on alcohol was becoming a really big, big problem.
00:08:27:16 - 00:08:57:22
Lisa
It was uncontainable anymore, and it was July, I think, 2017 that we were living in Brisbane. I had three kids, they were only two and two weren't in school and one was in grade one. And he had he had to go to rehab. So I was like, you know, these things simmering under the surface. It was an issue, but it was suddenly like front and centre.
00:08:58:00 - 00:09:20:12
Lisa
I was running my own business and I had become the breadwinner for our family and I had three little kids and we were up in Brisbane without any family support at all. So I decided in that moment, okay, we've entered a different phase and I need to move down to Melbourne where both our families are and I mean the period of I think was three and a half weeks that he was in there.
00:09:20:15 - 00:09:43:10
Lisa
I did a trip to America, I was in a business mastermind, so I went and did that literally the day after he went into rehab. No, the day off he went into rehab. I jumped on a train down to the Gold Coast to run a retreat for business women. Yeah, my mum had flown up and we packed up our house.
00:09:43:15 - 00:10:04:14
Lisa
Mum and dad were amazing at that time. I removed the kids from all their that like a family Day-Care kinda school said goodbye to all our friends that we'd made. We'd been living there for five years and moved us down to Melbourne and I was like, okay, phew, we're here. But that's not it. Like then I had to find a place to live.
00:10:04:14 - 00:10:27:11
Lisa
Nick went into a rehab down in in Melbourne, so he was, he was not available and I had to get a kid into school wanting to kinda, wanting to day-care we had to decide we were living in Melbourne, get all utilities set up, do all the things I was running, live events like I ran an event with Gabe Lareau in Melbourne, I was running the business, it was just all luck, it was so on.
00:10:27:13 - 00:10:49:21
Lisa
And I remember there was a moment when I went to the family and friends night at the at the rehab that he was in in Melbourne. And this guy, I was the only one there and I was like, okay, this is awkward. And so I had the attention of this guy at the front of the room and he's just like, How are you, Liza?
00:10:49:23 - 00:11:09:11
Lisa
And I said, look, it's just a really big relief that Nick is here. He's getting the help that he needs, you know, it's great. He's like, Yeah. And I was just sort of, So how are you? And I said, Well, look, you know, the kids are a bit unsettled because it's been a really big time. So I'm just really focussed on just calming everything right down for them.
00:11:09:11 - 00:11:38:06
Lisa
I'm finding a house and he's like, Liza, how are you? And I just started crying. I hadn't thought about how I was. I didn't even think about it. It wasn't even on my radar for me to have needs for me to be feeling anything. It was just it was just all out. It was all just taking care of everyone else.
00:11:38:06 - 00:12:10:03
Lisa
I was high functioning. I had completely lost touch with Liza, you know? Yeah. And and I think that's okay for that to happen. But there's a cost, right? Yeah. So I get everyone sort of. We we find a house, we move in, I'm, you know, blend uniforms and like it was lawn and. And then maybe a month later I thought I had school source on my face and I went to the doctor and I said, I've got school source.
00:12:10:03 - 00:12:44:18
Lisa
And he said, No, you don't. You've got shingles. LS like shingles? What do you mean? is that why I'm just absolutely exhausted? And he's like, Maybe. And he said his place and I just explain what had been going on. He's like, I mean, this could be your body just telling you enough's enough. And and I do just want to tell you that other viruses love jumping on the back of shingles, chronic fatigue, loves glandular fever.
00:12:44:20 - 00:13:10:15
Lisa
So just really be careful if you don't rest now and let your body heal, the likelihood of something else appearing is high. So I just wanted to later, I'm like, I don't have the chance to rest and thought, that's not even who who rests when there's so much to do, everything's on me. That was that was my story at the time.
00:13:10:15 - 00:13:35:20
Lisa
Like everything's on me. I, I don't have time for this. And so I really sat with that. I, I was out for two weeks. It really just knocked me sideways. I thought a lot about how I had been telling myself certain things weren't possible for me. I had this beautiful, amazing body that was getting myself and my family through this thing and I had neglected it completely.
00:13:36:02 - 00:13:59:21
Lisa
This is also at the same time as running a business around teaching women about Whole Foods and all of that sort of stuff. So I wasn't eating badly. It wasn't like my lifestyle was crazy. It was that the load was too much. I was unable to see that I could not continue functioning in the way that I was functioning.
00:13:59:21 - 00:14:25:20
Lisa
And so I made some changes. And and one of the biggest things that I did at that time, I think it really served me because the next few years of of Nic in and out of rehab been riding that recovery rollercoaster and then ultimately and very unfortunately his death in September 2019 was that I decided I had to start to take care of myself.
00:14:25:22 - 00:14:58:06
Lisa
And I and I still didn't have a load of capacity. And this is why I talk to women about this all the time. And right now I'm solo parenting my kids and running a business, and yet I have completely revamped the expectation that I have for myself and what I focus on in my life. And I remember I would wake up in the morning and I'd check in with myself and I would say, What does Liza need today to feel good?
00:14:58:08 - 00:15:22:04
Lisa
It wouldn't have to be much. It was like this gentle, just moving myself in the direction of just checking back in with me. What, what actually do I need? And sometimes it would just be sitting by myself and just having a coffee on my own at the cafe. Just, just doing that for myself. Sometimes it would be going for a walk.
00:15:22:04 - 00:15:49:18
Lisa
Sometimes I think I really want to call my best friend and to speak to her. I need to just carve out half an hour for that smallest things. It was not a big, huge, crazy thing that I did, but I started to honour myself what I was needing instead of making life about everyone else all the time. Addiction consumed my life and this was just a lovely way for me.
00:15:49:18 - 00:16:21:03
Lisa
And then so I could go, You know what I am? I'm really tired and I wouldn't even be able to acknowledge that before. And so I think I just need to have a bath or I just need to go to bed early. That's what I really need. And that was kind of it felt like I look back now and I think it was really a revolution in my life because it started to connect, connect me back in to myself after a period of just absolutely not being yet.
00:16:21:05 - 00:16:48:08
Filly
Yeah, it's so interesting. That was so much ooh, so many bits and pieces I want to pull out of that. It's interesting. First of all, the body is amazing. The body is amazing for giving us very strong signals when we're not listening to ourselves or when we're disconnected. So it's like shingles or whatever it is. For some people it's chronic fatigue, severe bloating.
00:16:48:10 - 00:17:09:20
Filly
Sometimes it's emotional, mental as well, anxiety, whatever it is. And it's super interesting too. Do you find now I'm kind of like jumping all over the place. Do you find now that there's more subtle ways that your body talks to you and it doesn't have to get to the point? It's like shingles, chronic fatigue.
00:17:09:22 - 00:17:50:07
Lisa
I don't even I can't really remember what we covered. If you years ago, it was the last time I was really sick. I am so good at noticing what my body needs now. So my glands go up a little bit at the back and I'll, I'll just sort of I'm just, I look, I think a part of the benefit of those COVID years, especially here in Melbourne when we really couldn't do much, was it really reset in terms of there was no there were a lot of demands on us.
00:17:50:09 - 00:18:16:02
Lisa
Obviously someone who had kids at home and was trying to work and all of that. So it was it was not fun, but there was also no extra things to do. So it was like we found a new set point like, this is what it feels like to not be. I mean, we were all exhausted because it was just freaking exhausting, the whole monotony of it.
00:18:16:02 - 00:18:42:20
Lisa
But it wasn't in the way of like, it's been a massive weekend. I'm exhausted. I've got to get here, Mum needs this done. I've got to get to Bunnings to get the thing and then that's before he's got to be in soccer a bloody an hour away. And what do you know? Like there's just a frantic ness to it all that disappeared and I think a big part of 2022 for me and for a lot of my friends was like this hangover effect of that.
00:18:42:20 - 00:19:08:18
Lisa
Like why isn't that why aren't we kicking back into gear? Where did it go? It's like our bodies were like, No, actually now we know when we're gone too far, whereas I think before that we actually we hadn't even recognised we were we were asking too much of ourselves. Yeah, but suddenly you're asked to do that again after this extended period of not being able to.
00:19:08:20 - 00:19:18:00
Lisa
And, and, and my body is so clear with me, I love it. It's like, here we are and now we know what to do.
00:19:18:02 - 00:19:40:06
Filly
Yes, yes, yes. In the past, if I. When I struggled to learn to listen to myself, I didn't know how it was usually like full on histamine intolerance and flare ups. Now it's just like, usually would be like a bit of tightness in the chest or a little bit of tension in the diaphragm or underneath. And I'm like, That's my subtle signal.
00:19:40:06 - 00:19:44:00
Filly
What do you need, body? What do you need? Unconscious mind?
00:19:44:02 - 00:20:09:19
Lisa
Yeah. And it's and it's really amazing. And so often for me it is just rest like, I mean, sleep is like my, my, my number one friend I like. I really prioritise resting. How do you rest. Do you do that like. Well I don't run like you can go to, you can go to bed and have a little lie down.
00:20:09:19 - 00:20:20:01
Lisa
And I tell the kids now, I mean they're at an age where I can be like, See your mum's going for an hour, don't anyone talk to me. Yeah, on the weekends. It's amazing.
00:20:20:04 - 00:20:25:02
Filly
Yeah. Talking about Slate. So in my book, anyone watching on.
00:20:25:02 - 00:20:25:17
Lisa
YouTube.
00:20:25:22 - 00:20:27:19
Filly
Ooh, Lisa, it's the do.
00:20:27:19 - 00:20:32:04
Lisa
You call it forward or forward? Forward. But it's.
00:20:32:05 - 00:20:34:10
Filly
C I was the fir I've always been saying.
00:20:34:10 - 00:20:36:14
Lisa
Forward.
00:20:36:16 - 00:20:38:21
Filly
Lisa Right. The forward.
00:20:38:23 - 00:20:42:17
Lisa
No, that's what I said. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know the expert on this.
00:20:42:19 - 00:21:05:05
Filly
I think I'm wrong because I was talking to my sister. He's very clever with words and she's like, You're saying it wrong, okay? And it's awkward about talking about Slate. So in my book, I have referenced a survey that you did a I think back in 2020 to 2022. Yeah, yeah. Over 1400 women took this survey, which is also just a phenomenal feat.
00:21:05:07 - 00:21:11:21
Filly
And there was a lot of stuff. What was it titled? Sleep, Sex, Energy and more that right?
00:21:11:22 - 00:21:14:02
Lisa
Stress. Stress. Yeah.
00:21:14:08 - 00:21:41:17
Filly
Okay. So there were some interesting things both about energy and slate. So we'd sleep seven at a ten. I'm just rating my night. Seven out of ten women said that they know what would improve their sleep. 10.2% said it was impossible to improve their sleep at this time and also 46.6% of women who it said that they might do the things to improve their sleep.
00:21:41:19 - 00:21:42:09
Lisa
Right.
00:21:42:11 - 00:22:01:09
Filly
I am also someone who I like Slate highest value, biggest priority because I know that I'm Dragon mom and like that's really where my body will start breaking down if I don't get sleep. So what did what else did you discover in that survey or why did you also run it? And yeah, can you talk a bit more about sleep?
00:22:01:09 - 00:22:31:08
Lisa
Yeah. So I mean, I was just really curious about where women were at at that stage of 2022. I was certainly not thriving and and I kept hearing everyone saying the same sorts of things. So I thought, well, let's get some data around this. Let's just see what's going on. And I cried regularly as those results were coming in because it doesn't paint a very good picture for us.
00:22:31:10 - 00:23:01:17
Lisa
The questions that I had around sleep and what I think is really interesting about sleep is I think that we have normalised being tired. I think that that is the narrative that most women have is I'm exhausted, busy, so overwhelmed and they're not lying. But it's also like we we can do things about this. We don't have to.
00:23:01:19 - 00:23:23:14
Lisa
And I think that that's the thing about that the 10% of people I don't know, maybe the menopausal and they just the sleep it gone right off and they've tried all sorts of different things. Maybe people who do struggle within Sonia anxiety at night time and they might have tried a whole heap of things and they're just like, I can't do anything about this.
00:23:23:14 - 00:23:52:20
Lisa
Or I do shift work. And there is always absolutely going to be that group of people. And then and then there's this big chunk who are like, Yeah, I know what I could do. Most likely not going to do it. And I think that they're probably the women who were like, I work so hard and I just want hours to myself of quiet at night and and stop it like I'm allowed to have that.
00:23:52:20 - 00:24:11:03
Lisa
But then I wake up the next morning regretting it, wishing that they'd just gone to sleep because they're not functioning very well in their daily life, or they're people who are binge watching shows or they can't stop the scroll at night time. And so they're like, Yes, I know, I just need to turn up my phone, I need to do it.
00:24:11:05 - 00:24:31:06
Lisa
But I'm just I know myself too well. I'm not going to do that. Maybe they know that that not having though, those two glasses of wine each night that they know affects their sleep, they just know themselves and they're just saying, I'm not going to I'm not going to not have the wine. I look forward to the wine.
00:24:31:06 - 00:25:05:09
Lisa
The wine is a lovely part of my evening. It helps me get through. You know, there's all sorts of reasons we create for ourselves to justify unhealthy or dysfunctional behaviour like we all do it. I'm very good at it, and yet it doesn't serve us. Yeah. And so I think that that group of women value something higher than sleep at at this particular stage of their lives or have tried to change habits and, and they haven't been able to make them stick.
00:25:05:09 - 00:25:39:11
Lisa
So they don't believe themselves that they would be able to actually change the sleep hygiene and their sleep routine and feel like either people being like, are you saying, Lisa, that you wake up in the morning feeling refreshed and. Yeah, well, isn't that how we're meant to feel? And they're like, literally no one does. Are you wake up, you wake up before your alarm, like your voice times.
00:25:39:13 - 00:26:07:16
Lisa
And it's it's a foreign concept to most people. But I look at my kids, I have always been pretty strict on sleep, like it's all kids that aren't well slept on don't really like hanging out with them. They're the they're annoying and kids those kids that are well slept in such better company right Like we can do stuff.
00:26:07:21 - 00:26:18:12
Lisa
Yeah totally at the stage of all the sleepovers and stuff and I feel like our weekends are now just like, just trying to get through the day to get them into sleep so that they can be okay again. That it's.
00:26:18:12 - 00:26:22:18
Filly
Tight. Yeah. Rotten little kids off to sleep because.
00:26:22:20 - 00:26:46:20
Lisa
And, and I just keep looking at them and just thinking, well, I'm a human to them. I'm also not my best self when I'm tired and I think as a solo parent, it became so obvious to me. I am the captain of the ship and when I'm tired, everyone knows I am not like I'm, I'm, I'm eating foods to help me get through.
00:26:47:02 - 00:27:10:15
Lisa
I'm cranky at them. I have lower tolerance for all the noise, but I don't want to be that kind of person. So for me, in the life that I lead, which is running my own business, parenting my kids on my own, running this house on my own, I just don't have time to be tired. So I prioritise sleep because everything feels better.
00:27:10:17 - 00:27:11:22
Lisa
Yeah. When I did. Yeah.
00:27:12:00 - 00:27:33:06
Filly
Yeah, yeah. Awesome. Sometimes I think it's about stacking up the pain too. It's like, okay, well if the wine, for example, is more important than sleep because it feels nice in the moment and it's regulating my nervous system or, you know, whatever, it's a nice little trait. But then you look at waking up exhausted and how you perform.
00:27:33:06 - 00:27:47:07
Filly
I feel throughout the day and maybe the impact that you're having in other people. Sometimes people forget when they get to that time to have the wine or watched Netflix or scroll through the phone, just kind of how painful life was during the day.
00:27:47:09 - 00:28:04:19
Lisa
Right? Yes. Yeah, it's a whole thing. But that is that I remember talking about or this bedtime procrastination. And it really is like we we play games with ourselves, don't we. We like I, I.
00:28:04:19 - 00:28:13:19
Filly
Deserve that dissipates Yes I definite. Yeah I, I do actually quite enjoy watching Netflix at night.
00:28:13:21 - 00:28:14:13
Lisa
So I've.
00:28:14:15 - 00:28:37:05
Filly
Never really been the binge ninja but it's very interesting. I've done some experiments with myself. If I've had a day where my cup is empty because I've been giving giving, whether it's to clients or children or just housework or marketing or whatever it is, and I go to bed resentful, I will watch that Netflix that it will affect my sleep.
00:28:37:07 - 00:28:37:20
Lisa
When.
00:28:38:00 - 00:28:58:15
Filly
Whereas on other days when it's just like this feels like a nice day, I'm in alignment. I'm still doing the things that I need to do in order for business and family to function. But, you know, I'm happy to in times, to myself, I watch Netflix and it's like the most enjoyable experience and I'll go to sleep and I sleep great and I wake up refreshed.
00:28:58:17 - 00:29:00:16
Lisa
Wow, There's something in that.
00:29:00:16 - 00:29:17:22
Filly
There's something in that. Don't know it scientifically. I'll do some more thinking on that, but very interesting. So when you said exhaustion is just what people think is normal, another stat that came from your survey was 98.2% of women never feel fully rested, which just like.
00:29:18:03 - 00:29:20:07
Lisa
What the hell I know, right?
00:29:20:09 - 00:29:30:13
Filly
Crazy, crazy, crazy. So what do you think? Why do you think women are so burnt out? Like, what do you think is the deepest root cause happening here?
00:29:30:15 - 00:30:03:08
Lisa
I think that there's a few different ones. I actually created an overwhelmed type quiz because I think that that there's different reasons, like we're different people. And and it's not always just that there's a lot on. I think that is absolutely the truth for most women that I know, which is just the mental, domestic emotional load of being a woman these days.
00:30:03:08 - 00:30:27:16
Lisa
I think unequal division in households is a is a massive, massive problem. So think it's it's falling on women. We know it is because the statistics tell us it is it is tiring to be a woman in the world at the moment, especially if you've got children. But then there's all these I mean, I've worked with women for ten years.
00:30:27:16 - 00:31:08:08
Lisa
Over ten years I've been a part of communities. I hear the same things over and over again, and it's forced me to look at this in my own life, too. You know, there's some people who have such high standards for themselves. You know, they, they, they are working harder and life feels harder than it needs to because they have these, you know, the perfectionist top tendencies of they really want to be knocking it out of the park in all areas of their life.
00:31:08:10 - 00:31:32:16
Lisa
Yeah. And, you know, like, I totally know people like this. I've seen and coached women like this. It's like, what would it what would it be like if you just sort of let yourself drop that ball for a little while? What if it was okay if, you know, if the kids started to put their own clothes away and it wasn't really tidy in in their wardrobes and you just sort of let that be okay for a while.
00:31:32:18 - 00:32:00:16
Lisa
my God. I couldn't. and it's like, well, no, it's okay. If you like that level of order and structure and, you know, it's never about be telling people exactly what to do, but just like, pay attention to where maybe you're adding to your load because of your expectations for what your life should look like, what your body should look like, what parenting should look like, what your house should look like, what work life balance should look like.
00:32:00:16 - 00:32:31:12
Lisa
What? Just hang on, take it all back a notch. But then there's the people who, you know, don't really care that much about that stuff. That's not their underlying issue. It's more that they literally can't say no. So, you know, the people who give us. Yeah, and they like giving and they so they get a lot of self-worth from being someone who can be there for others, who is contributing and volunteering and taking it on and saying, yes, come over and yes, we'll be there.
00:32:31:12 - 00:32:51:05
Lisa
And all the things that the kids are involved in, all of the stuff and they're wrecked. They haven't thought about themselves or maybe even put themselves on the little agenda for the week because it's just about everybody else. And they they they get resentful even about it, but they don't even know that they have the choice to say no.
00:32:51:10 - 00:33:15:22
Lisa
Yeah. Like, do you see what I mean? Like this? I think that it's different types of, of people and we're we're unknowingly adding to our load when we don't need to because it's enough just to be doing life, I feel at the moment. So, yeah, I think I'm going to do that.
00:33:16:00 - 00:33:19:14
Filly
Yeah. The quiz. I actually did it earlier today.
00:33:19:15 - 00:33:20:23
Lisa
What did you get?
00:33:21:01 - 00:33:42:17
Filly
I was there. Organiser Right. So I say, what was it when, when you're in full power, you're in natural organisation like Yes, yes, yes, yes that's right. When overwhelm strikes, you can tap into becoming a busy bee, which is so funny. Guys like our podcast is ending, but even at a busy people, my message is my message.
00:33:42:19 - 00:33:46:16
Lisa
We teach what we need to learn all year.
00:33:46:18 - 00:33:49:02
Filly
Yeah. What was what was yours?
00:33:49:04 - 00:34:13:03
Lisa
What is yours? Well, I don't know, because I know them all so well. I think sometimes people are so, you know, I'm the person that people like. I'm holding it together for a lot of different things. And so that's fine until it's really not until overwhelm kicks in. And I'm like, Go away. I don't want to have any responsibilities whatsoever.
00:34:13:07 - 00:34:33:23
Lisa
I'm going to leave on an island somewhere and no one can talk to me like, yeah, yeah, I have, you know, in my life, I guess where I've found myself is yeah, Captain. And and there's no one, you know, next to me really helping me. Captain. The ships.
00:34:34:01 - 00:34:34:08
Filly
Yeah.
00:34:34:09 - 00:35:02:01
Lisa
You know, the business and and the. And my family. And so sometimes I'm totally exhilarated by that. And it's where I actually need to be. It's who I am. But as soon as like, you know. God, it's even been this week, I just was thinking, you know, there's just some stuff going on with one of my kids are like, You're not you're not doing enough.
00:35:02:03 - 00:35:30:11
Lisa
You know, what else could we be doing? You're. You're letting the team down. Yeah. And then my and then my. You know, I just. I don't even check my mail like, pretty bad. I, I got diagnosed ADHD as well, which is unsurprising to literally every single person around me. But I was like, wow, this mum was like, That explains a lot, darling of care.
00:35:30:13 - 00:35:56:20
Lisa
And so I can so a lot of different bits does very much overwhelm me. Like life admin will just start stacking up and then I'll go into just the type of overwhelm that doesn't feel good. So that's why over all these years of teaching, it's been about simplifying life like take it off the agenda. If it can be off the agenda, I literally cannot cope with my own life.
00:35:56:22 - 00:36:28:22
Lisa
If there's there's too much expected of me, but on a constant basis. And I think, you know, being a creative person, I need I need white space, I need it. And it just feels like it's all the time. All the time, all the time. So it's an interesting journey. I don't think anyone's immune from it. I mean, the fricking WhatsApp groups that I'm a part of because of school and sports groups and everyone's birthday party has a WhatsApp group and even that's just enough to be like, Yeah, yeah, whatever.
00:36:28:22 - 00:36:42:02
Filly
So I meet your colleagues, friends. Dr. Christie Goodwin talks about to like all the notifications that are popping up like ding, ding, ding. It's kind of like the little tiger chasing a nervous system every time it comes up.
00:36:42:04 - 00:36:48:07
Lisa
So brilliant. And I learning the archive function in WhatsApp was a game changer.
00:36:48:08 - 00:36:49:11
Filly
Love it. Yeah.
00:36:49:12 - 00:36:53:12
Lisa
Like you can beep away and I'll check you when I want to check you.
00:36:53:15 - 00:37:04:09
Filly
Yeah. Yeah. It was interesting when you were talking about your, your body burn out experience with the shingles and everything that was happening. Totally conceited Erin that now. Totally. I can say that you.
00:37:04:10 - 00:37:08:06
Lisa
All move us to Melbourne all get everything.
00:37:08:06 - 00:37:17:11
Filly
So whilst also running a conference and a retreat for a whole heap of women who need what need my help to eat healthy.
00:37:17:13 - 00:37:27:13
Lisa
But I mean also there's been a bit of codependence to unravel in my story, let's be honest. Yeah, it's been a lot of a lot of work done.
00:37:27:13 - 00:37:30:00
Filly
Yeah, it's always like The Onion. It's beautiful.
00:37:30:02 - 00:37:31:04
Lisa
Sorry.
00:37:31:06 - 00:37:50:20
Filly
Sorry for our listeners. I'm going to put in the show notes that overwhelmed talk quiz. I loved it too. When I got my report because there were like the red red flag signals. But also at the end, three really simple things that you could implement. Today. I'm like, Yes, I think mine wins. Don't say yes or say no to some things.
00:37:50:20 - 00:37:57:05
Filly
Class and space and common, but that one. But I'm like, yeah, that all totally achievable doing it.
00:37:57:07 - 00:37:58:20
Lisa
Going to be Yeah.
00:37:59:02 - 00:38:12:09
Filly
Yeah. So going back to your to this story with your husband Nick so he alcohol dependency and then he ended up passing away 2019.
00:38:12:11 - 00:38:15:07
Lisa
Yeah yeah. So you've had.
00:38:15:09 - 00:38:34:23
Filly
You've had a massive journey like that is huge experiencing that and I you happy to talk into grief and also how it's connected to burn out and if someone's experiencing these whether it's the passing of a loved one. Well sometimes just like there's different types of losses as well.
00:38:35:01 - 00:38:35:13
Lisa
If people.
00:38:35:13 - 00:38:40:07
Filly
Are carrying grief. how can we navigate this.
00:38:40:09 - 00:39:13:22
Lisa
Well, I, I, yeah, it is has been a total process. And at the very beginning it was so it was just so shocking. He died in India. It was very confusing. And I mean, there's your own grief and then and then there's your children have just lost their father. I mean, it was unfathomable. I will never forget, like I still grieve on behalf of them to.
00:39:14:00 - 00:39:41:02
Lisa
So it's it's this whole big thing. But of course, I was high functioning, Lisa, for quite a while. I just thought, I've got to get the kids through this. And and I was I wasn't even on the planet. I can't even I don't even my memories of that time are really hazy. I do remember a few key moments, but I knew I just had to get through.
00:39:41:02 - 00:40:03:03
Lisa
I mean, I remember the day before his funeral took a month because we had to get the body back and, you know, do all sorts of things. It was a full process. And and I was like, I've got to get up tomorrow and I have to take my children to their dad's funeral. Excuse me, How am I meant to actually do this?
00:40:03:03 - 00:40:23:05
Lisa
Could someone just please come and be me? Because this is just too, too much. But I was so scared of feeling the depth of feeling that I had at that time that I just kind of was I was I was feeling it, but I was skimming the surface. It was time to really go. There was just I was.
00:40:23:09 - 00:40:54:14
Lisa
I was too afraid. So I delayed the grief. Yeah. I mean, then you think about it. We covered happened very soon after and there was just this. What is. Hang on. What is actually really happening here? And and that was a big distraction. And then once again, I was just being asked to rise into coping with it all, like finding a way through.
00:40:54:15 - 00:41:25:00
Lisa
But there were times there that I was like, Oof, I want to I want to outrun this grief. And it is like I am literally here in my house. I can't escape it. So I started to really move into it a little bit more at that stage, but still not fully and I think it's just one of those things where no one has a linear path through grief.
00:41:25:02 - 00:41:51:05
Lisa
But I wish I had maybe let myself fall apart. You know, I, I was speaking to a friend recently and she said, you never had a day where you just lay in bed. I never did. I never did. I never just succumbed to the horribleness I had three kids. Like, I actually didn't have the luxury to do that, but I probably could have like, if I just was like, I'm tapping out doodles.
00:41:51:05 - 00:42:16:12
Lisa
I am was very conscious of what the kids needed and they needed stability and security. What what started to happen was actually when COVID was over in 2022 and we were being asked to get back into life. And and I actually think the grief over what we lost over those two years has not been collectively dealt with at all.
00:42:16:14 - 00:42:43:15
Lisa
I actually think people are holding on to a whole lot of grief that they've now just parked and exists inside them and it is not reconciled and it is having big time impacts on people. And that's a whole other story. I know for me it was coming out of that really feeling very depleted and realising that I wasn't as okay as I thought I might be.
00:42:43:17 - 00:43:17:08
Lisa
And this then starting to unravel things with work and with my creativity, my ability to lead, have thoughts that made sense and plans that I could actually follow through on. It was all just gone. And so I thought, okay, I'm going to need to be kind to myself. And I really I really I really did a lot of work that year to move things through my and and and also a lot of talking and all sorts of things.
00:43:17:09 - 00:43:40:12
Lisa
That's what I really worked on. So I was like 20, 23, I'm hitting it. Yeah, we're going to be ready for 2023. Lisa's back and I remember I was just like really talking myself almost into it. And then at the start of 2023, I had this I had an had an operation. And it was a very, very simple procedure.
00:43:40:14 - 00:44:01:23
Lisa
But I spiked a temperature afterwards and they kept me in hospital and and then I went home the next day, and I was really not okay for a week. Things got worse before. And so I went back and they're like, you know, this isn't right. You've obviously, you know, and then I went on these hardcore antibiotics. I mean, once again, I can't even remember the last time I've been on antibiotics.
00:44:01:23 - 00:44:26:08
Lisa
I don't even have Panadol in my house. And I was so, so sick. I was so sick, I lost a whole heap of weight. I couldn't eat. I, I was just really, really not okay. And then soon after that, the relationship I'd been in for four years ended and I was just like, You know what? I just can't even I can't even pretend that I am okay right now.
00:44:26:08 - 00:44:58:07
Lisa
I am so not okay. I am I don't have it together in any area of my life. And I am really, really done feeling like this. I, I haven't. I grieved enough, like I can't do it again in this house, pounding that pavement, being in this life. No, I'm not doing it this way again. And I knew I needed something radical to kind of shift my gears because I had done so much work.
00:44:58:09 - 00:45:22:12
Lisa
And and I and I just found myself at a real loss and so I thought to myself, Right, what is the most creative thing that you can think of for this stage of life that you found yourself in right now? What what could we really do here if if we were just going to let it all go for a little while?
00:45:22:16 - 00:45:46:14
Lisa
What? What, what, what could we do? Lisa? And ever since Nick died, I had wanted to take the kids on a trip, and obviously COVID happened and we couldn't go frickin anywhere for two years. And last year my son had started year seven, so and he's my eldest, so I knew were going to be entering into a very different phase of life over these next few years.
00:45:46:15 - 00:46:04:02
Lisa
And the thought just sort of I was like, you know what I mean? It had been simmering at the start of 2023 about this trip and then the operation and then and then The Break-Up. And I'm like, you know what? I think I just need to go. I think I need to book a trip. I think I need to get out of here.
00:46:04:02 - 00:46:23:10
Lisa
I think I really need it to be long enough to have an enduring impact on me. I need life, I need excitement. I need to be with my children. I don't need it doesn't even make sense. No one around me was coming. My family was Lisa.
00:46:23:12 - 00:46:26:18
Filly
Just great.
00:46:26:20 - 00:47:02:04
Lisa
They actually said, Do you think you're of sound mind? And I was like, Actually, no. And so this is what I need to go. And you just trust me. Yeah. And, you know, they eventually, when I came back, they're like, Wow, I didn't even see what you were seeing for yourself and what you needed. I can see it now and yeah, I within I ended up, I started to flock to the kids about it, just planting a few seeds and then they see they were nervous but curious and I did some work and I researched where we might be able to go and what it would cost.
00:47:02:04 - 00:47:22:07
Lisa
And I started to just put it out to the universe a bit and it was like a magic carpet ride. These things just sort of kept falling into place, falling into place. Friends were getting kicked out of a rental and were looking to buy and so were looking for somewhere they could. Just because I rent my house, they could just like take over the rent for a few months and then like bang, bang, bang, bang.
00:47:22:07 - 00:47:53:15
Lisa
I booked the tickets and a month later we were on a plane out of Melbourne and that was July. We got back in November and it was honestly, I call it travel medicine. It healed me, it healed us. It was a reminder of what life can be. It was a reminder of who I was and we went back to, we saw so many different things, but we had very profound time in Croatia, which is where Nick, Nick's dad was from, and he learned the language of been there with him.
00:47:53:15 - 00:48:16:20
Lisa
He he was half Croatian. The kids have land that they own there, and I didn't know at the time how important that visiting there was going to be for all of us. But this is what I think about grief is I mean, my kids will always grieve the fact that they don't have a dad. It's going to pop up for them in crazy times.
00:48:16:20 - 00:48:34:15
Lisa
I mean, my daughter got a leadership badge in grade six and I was at the assembly and I was sad because he's not there and he should be there. He should have been with us in Croatia. He should be here for all of it. And he's not here. And it will never actually not be sad. It's just that I needed to fully deal with it.
00:48:34:15 - 00:48:58:07
Lisa
I needed to fully feel it and and express it. And and it's just become this part of who I am now. It's part of my story. It's that we we had a huge loss and we can be okay. We can life can be okay and you can also experience be grief. None of us are going to escape it.
00:48:58:09 - 00:49:16:15
Lisa
And we don't talk about it enough. We don't talk about like this people you walk past whose lives are tilted on its axis because they've just lost someone really important to them and they're just trying to show up and be a normal human. But they don't feel normal anymore. We don't talk about it and we don't normalise like I don't even know.
00:49:16:16 - 00:49:38:09
Lisa
I couldn't even imagine having to go to work in an office and pretend to be okay. Like, what is that doing? What is that stuffing down? I mean, I was doing it and I was living a pretty free life away from, you know that. Anyway, I it's something that I feel really, really passionately whenever I speak about grief on my socials.
00:49:38:11 - 00:49:50:20
Lisa
It's just that stuff just gets shared far and wide because we don't have great examples of grief conversations. I think people look at me and they're like, How you doing?
00:49:50:22 - 00:50:17:11
Filly
I yeah, I love that though. I think, like the standard answer is look at the grief cycle. But you, you, you have been a great example of just listening to yourself, What do I need in order to shift this and move this and turn it into something that's not going to drag me down, but actually so that I can evolve and and still carry it with me?
00:50:17:13 - 00:50:40:05
Lisa
I mean, I think in the early stages I was afraid of it, but now I'm like, here it is. Hello, friend. I'm I know what to do with you. I know that if I feel you and I'm with you and I let myself go here, that we'll move through this faster. I did not believe that in the beginning.
00:50:40:07 - 00:51:08:21
Lisa
The kids. The kids taught me a really important lesson. Very, very early on I was actually. So he died on September 13. We found out on September 15 and and September 20, September 19, we were flying to Bali, the kids and I, for my 40th birthday, which was the 21st of September, was the first time overseas, really big deal.
00:51:08:21 - 00:51:29:06
Lisa
Everyone was pumped. And I thought, what do I what do I do? I can remember being on my daughter's floor, a suitcase open and just staring up at my mum with just crying, going, Is this the right thing? Like what? Can you just tell me what to do? Mum? Do I take him or do I not take them?
00:51:29:06 - 00:51:52:15
Lisa
Do they need a family or do they need this holiday? I don't know what I'm doing. I really did not know what I was doing and she said, Go. And I went and on that trip they really showed me that, that children and also I think adults we they they can't be in an emotion extended for a really long period of time.
00:51:52:15 - 00:52:16:01
Lisa
Like they feel it. They feel it, too. It's fullness and then they're moving on. What we learnt on that trip, what I learnt on that trip is that grief and joy coexist. You can't eat. They, they can't stay in it all the time. And I learnt, I thought, well you know, I'm just watching them have the best time of their lives at the worst time of their lives.
00:52:16:02 - 00:52:37:05
Lisa
What I that is this wow. Is no reason, there's no rationality, there's no right or wrong way to do this. And I know it must have looked very strange to people what we were doing. It was the best thing I could ever have done for us at that stage, because when we were crying, when we were feeling it, we were all just together.
00:52:37:07 - 00:52:57:03
Lisa
You know, we could just be in it without anybody else. And and I, you know, I had this sense like, we're going to get home and, you know, life is going to ask stuff of us. But in this moment right now, it's asking nothing. And we can just do this the way we need to do it. yeah.
00:52:57:05 - 00:53:13:18
Lisa
There's no right or wrong way to grieve. It's not linear and it's not the frickin, what, five, six step, seven stages of grief. I don't even know how many there are, but mine certainly did not. I have. I still get angry at him. I still have all sorts of stuff, like, it's crazy. It's a crazy ride.
00:53:13:20 - 00:53:15:23
Filly
It's almost like a spiral.
00:53:16:01 - 00:53:17:23
Lisa
it's just. Yeah. A friend won't come.
00:53:17:23 - 00:53:18:22
Filly
Along and two things come.
00:53:18:22 - 00:53:57:07
Lisa
Along and. Yeah, yeah, she did explain to me once, like waves. And in the beginning, the waves just like, come and they like you are crashed, you are underneath the wave and you just desperately trying to kind of get a and then after a little while, the waves are still really big, but there's a break in between them so you can kind of breathe for a bit and then the wave will come again and then and then the waves just, you know, they come and then maybe not as high and maybe you don't go under and there's a little bit more of a break, but you are kind of destined always to be in a
00:53:57:07 - 00:54:24:10
Lisa
choppy ocean, you know? And it's just that there will be bigger breaks and they'll be less intense. But still, it's the ocean, you know? Yeah. And I loved I loved that. Yeah. I wish someone told me it was going to take years. Yeah. Because I sort of had a feeling like we got three days a year of firsts, and I'm like, look, look at us having grieved.
00:54:24:12 - 00:54:33:21
Lisa
Even after two years I thought, yeah, I feel a shift here and it was a big shift but it's still, Yeah, no processing.
00:54:33:22 - 00:54:59:04
Filly
Okay. We have covered so many different things. Thank you so much for your generosity. Your I just love your honesty. I think that's what really drew me to you. Lisa. Your honesty, your vulnerability. You're in a space of wellness that it's like and I, you know, it's kind of like figure it out as I go. And that's okay because I think we all are.
00:54:59:06 - 00:55:17:23
Lisa
Yes, I think we I think there's very few people who can sit in the space of expert of knowing all the things, because the pace in which we're all learning means that we are literally always evolving and learning and growing in our knowledge and understanding. Yeah.
00:55:18:01 - 00:55:37:06
Filly
So if you're going to leave one piece of advice, especially to those who might be feeling overwhelmed, whether it's they're moving through grief or just the the heaviness, the bigness of life that they feel they're carrying, what would you what would be one piece of advice you'd love to leave? Leave?
00:55:37:06 - 00:56:14:16
Lisa
Well, it's funny because when I was overseas, I was thinking about how connected I felt to my kids and to myself and the world and how creative I felt and how everything felt possible again. It was such a great place to be. And after the years of just like, what the hell even is going on here, and I, I sat and I thought, how am I going to how to take this home when it's school lunches and, you know, karate is on Wednesdays and man ins and soccer and this and then the other and all the things, you know.
00:56:14:18 - 00:56:37:13
Lisa
And I thought, well, what if I gave myself 5 hours a week? Belisa? What if that was just the goal? And and I did things with that 5 hours that would just for me. And it was not like, you know, get to Polaris or something. It was like, No, no, no, no. What? Just random stuff. Stuff on my own, stuff with people.
00:56:37:13 - 00:57:08:00
Lisa
Whatever it is, it doesn't even matter. Like, it just had to be something that would would just connect me back into that sense of life being right filled with good things because they were available. It's just that we get into our routine and we're not looking out for it like you are when you just arrived in Shinkai. Tara You know, so, so I gave myself this challenge of, of 5 hours a week and it changed everything.
00:57:08:02 - 00:57:34:14
Lisa
I've been to more theatre than I've ever been to in my life. I'm going out for dinners. I'm finding like even I'll have dinner on and instead of just like looking at my phone or doing some work or hanging out the washing, I'll put my runners on and I'll go and I'll sit at the beach for a bit or go for a little walk, or I'll have a dance party or something at home.
00:57:34:16 - 00:57:57:05
Lisa
Because when you're tuned into what I wanted, how could I use this time? I have time available. What do I actually need with that? What do I want my life to be filled with? If there was 5 hours, how would you use it is just such a brilliant redirect from that constant. I'm so overwhelmed. I've got no time for me.
00:57:57:07 - 00:58:29:22
Lisa
I've got no space to. Well, I mean, here's some time. What would be the what re the coolest thing for me to do for myself? I just getting a little bit creative with it. Just putting it out there, I just find is a more interesting point of inquiry than anything else. And found putting myself in new situations, keeping things fresh and exciting, you know, saying yes to the right things and no to the things that are just clogging up your space.
00:58:30:00 - 00:58:58:01
Lisa
Bloody awesome. And we can all do it. It's not like it's, you know, and there's no formula to it. It doesn't have to look like everyone else. You don't need to 5 hours in one go. But look, that survey in 2022, it made me so cross the, you know, the amount of me time. I think over 70% of my swimming is like three or less hours and I feel like I'm now on a bit of a mission to to like.
00:58:58:01 - 00:59:18:04
Lisa
It should just be a normal thing that we all expect that we at least have 5 hours. Yeah, I know that most people get five out of 5 hours from you might be surprised do a little digging. Yeah. Claim some time for you. See what happens. Life is passing us by. Nick died when he was 44 years old.
00:59:18:04 - 00:59:41:13
Lisa
That's not many years on the planet like we're here. So I don't. I just refuse to accept that my life has to be one big overwhelming mess that I'm constantly trying to survive. I want it to be fulfilling and fun and joy filled. So there's no one else who's going to do that for me. It's got to be me who makes it happen in 5 hours.
00:59:41:13 - 00:59:43:17
Lisa
Felt like a cool experiment. Yeah.
00:59:43:19 - 01:00:00:17
Filly
I love it. But anyone who is not yet following you on Instagram or Facebook, please do, because I just love it when you pop off in my feed. You really do Like it's creative. It's fun, it's inspiring, it's real, it's honest. And I'm like, I want to be more like.
01:00:00:19 - 01:00:06:13
Lisa
so it like, come and do puzzles with me is what's happening. I love puzzles.
01:00:06:13 - 01:00:08:20
Filly
Stories is so funny.
01:00:08:22 - 01:00:10:15
Lisa
So other than you, one lesson.
01:00:10:15 - 01:00:25:05
Filly
So I'm going to make sure in this story, no, I'm going to put links to your website because you've got lots of great resources there. Your podcast is amazing. Facebook, Instagram, definitely follow Lisa on those. And I'm also going to put your iPhone quiz in the show.
01:00:25:07 - 01:00:32:02
Lisa
Thank you so much for having me. Thank you.
01:00:32:04 - 01:00:42:07
Filly
Thank you so much for listening. We so appreciate you. If you'd like to give us extra smiles, drop us a review and spread the love. By sharing this episode.
01:00:42:09 - 01:01:00:15
Chris
You can also write your own state of burnout and the root Cause contributors by taking out ending body burnout assessment on our website. And if you're interested in learning about our group one on one ending Body burn out programs, shoot us a DM via Instagram or Facebook. Have the best day ever.
